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I think Whites as a whole tend to be more independent than other races in the chart.

This is reflected in the fact that Whites are less likely to be in gangs, have smaller family sizes, etc.

I myself have noticed Whites tend to be more introverted than nonWhites.

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So you think being more inclined to individuality as opposed to collectivism is a factor?  And that whites, as a whole, do not identify with their corresponding race as much as blacks or Hispanics do?

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Ok here's my theory then. I believe that a lot of whites go about their life more seriously and dramatically. So when things go wrong it's taken in a more serious way. Sometimes to an extend where it's like they don't want to live anymore. Maybe it has to do with the whole lifestyle and expectations of whites vs minorities.

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Perhaps.  Although I have an issue with accepting that analysis because it's not what I observe.  I see plenty of whites who just lol around all day, and plenty more who keep a balance between that and work.

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Quote: from DeoxysDNA at 11:36 pm on July 1, 2009

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Ok here's my theory then. I believe that a lot of whites go about their life more seriously and dramatically. So when things go wrong it's taken in a more serious way. Sometimes to an extend where it's like they don't want to live anymore. Maybe it has to do with the whole lifestyle and expectations of whites vs minorities.

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Perhaps. Although I have an issue with accepting that analysis because it's not what I observe. I see plenty of whites who just lol around all day, and plenty more who keep a balance between that and work.

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Yeah I see that at times too but I notice mainly at school that when something bad happens to someone that's white like for example. One time this white girl was going out with this boy for only a short time and when they broke up she acted like she wanted to kill herself. Vs when I see black couples break up it's like "Whateva I need a new man anyway".

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Sandhurst Tacama

Maybe males think more as independent individuals and do not think of themselves collectively as women do and that drives them to suicide?

Or maybe its just the white man burden?

Funny how some use those data for whites vs nonwhites but not for male vs females when the difference is much bigger.

Anyway here's some interptrations by some experts

http://news.medill.northwestern.edu/chicago/news.aspx?id=36733

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Experts explain high suicide rates among white men by illustrating factors that keep suicides rates low in minority communities.

"If you speak to African Americans about suicide, they will tell you it's a sign of weakness, not assertiveness. It's seen as shameful," said Dr. David Shaffer, professor of psychiatry and pediatrics at Columbia University.

"There's lots of weight given in white liberal cultures to free choice. African Americans tend to be more conservative in beliefs."

The Suicide Prevention Resource Center's Black American fact sheet said that "beliefs about suicide may act as a protective factor. Religious communities condemn suicide while secular attitudes regard suicide as unacceptable and a behavior of white culture, alien to black culture."

Vernellia Randall, a professor at the Institute on Race, Health Care and the Law, University of Dayton School of Law, said that while African Americans have lower suicide rates, they have higher homicide rates.

"Consider homicide and suicide together. When some people encounter stress they can no longer handle, they turn to violence. Some people turn the violence on themselves and we call that suicide. Some people turn the violence against other people and we call that homicide.

"It's about a cultural norm. In the black community, it is not that turning violence outward is acceptable, it's that turning it inward is more unacceptable."

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Im not even sure if that is good reason. But I bet culture and religion has something to do with it yeah.

I don't think that race thinking helps with suicide. But its true that using group help and being connected to a community and a religion helps.

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"Everyone helpin' each other whenever they can we makin' it happen, from nothin' to somethin'
That's how we be survivin'" - BEP

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Quote: from kidd rune at 11:35 pm on July 1, 2009

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I think Whites as a whole tend to be more independent than other races in the chart.  

 This is reflected in the fact that Whites are less likely to be in gangs, have smaller family sizes, etc.  

 I myself have noticed Whites tend to be more introverted than nonWhites.

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So you think being more inclined to individuality as opposed to collectivism is a factor? And that whites, as a whole, do not identify with their corresponding race as much as blacks or Hispanics do?

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I guess it's not so much Whites doing more, it's nonWhites doing less.

And your first explanation was similar to mine.

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Ask me an anonymous question
"Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored."
- Aldous Huxley

People keep looking at race stats and interpret it every which way. In the end no one really knows for sure why this group does this more or that group does that less.

The only thing useful I found for stats of that type is to tell those affected that theres a problem and maybe they can try to fix it somehow if they can.

It goes for the stats on tipping stats on fatherhood absence stats on crimes stats on suicides etc...

Also the stats may not be related to the nature of the WHOLE RACE itself but to how the INDIVIDUALS within it react and behave because of their culture.

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"Everyone helpin' each other whenever they can we makin' it happen, from nothin' to somethin'
That's how we be survivin'" - BEP

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I think that blaming non-whites for why whites are committing suicide is ridiculous. Take responsibility for your own stats.......

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Funny how that worls

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"Everyone helpin' each other whenever they can we makin' it happen, from nothin' to somethin'
That's how we be survivin'" - BEP

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Yes.

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You know, it is quite possible that this may be a factor. After all, one of the consequences of assuming a more individualistic point of view is that you're essentially on your own. When you fail, it's your fault and no one else's. You can't draw from a group's experiences and achievements to make you feel better about yourself. You can't draw on that to make you feel like you live in a place where you belong. Instead you have to do that all yourself, coming to terms with the personal relationships you have with your family, your friends, etc. and finding your own place in all that. A lot of the emotional turmoil a lot of adolescents go through often deals with this.

It is one of the critiques of individualism. I, however, think that those who truly undergo that process are stronger emotionally and more firm in their ideology than those who subscribe to a collective, which generally doesn't take nearly as much thought to come to terms with.  Also, it decreases the likelihood of that individual's worldview from being shattered by certain events or experiences also, meaning they can afford to remain more open-minded. I also think that logically it makes the most sense in many cases.

The question is - why might this be more common among whites than those of other races? And if it is more common among whites, if the other races adopted a more individualistic attitude themselves, would their suicide rates shoot up also? Or is it just one factor of many? They often say that depression has been linked genetically. Could it be possible that whites are genetically predisposed to feeling depressed more than other races as well?

Post edited at 10:19 pm on July 2, 2009 by Bud2400

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Although that group doesn't have to be race-related to help.  

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You're right, it doesn't. Though race has often been used in this way and if we're looking at race-specific things such as this, we'd have to consider how much of an individualistic attitude whites have vs. blacks, Hispanics, etc.  After all, an individualistic attitude regarding race could be connected with an individualistic attitude regarding non-race related things as well.

The disparity between whites committing suicide (per person) vs. blacks and Hispanics is a very real one. You told KR not to look at everything in terms of race, yet this disparity is very real. There has to be some reason(s) to explain it.

Post edited at 1:34 am on July 3, 2009 by Bud2400

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I think Whites as a whole tend to be more independent than other races in the chart.

This is reflected in the fact that Whites are less likely to be in gangs, have smaller family sizes, etc.

I myself have noticed Whites tend to be more introverted than nonWhites.

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This, and

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jakelong: "It's about a cultural norm. In the black community, it is not that turning violence outward is acceptable, it's that turning it inward is more unacceptable."

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this correlate with my experiences. I have noticed that blacks tend to be more family-oriented, in addition to religious (a closely binding factor). This collectivity as it is called is most likely the lingering response to the oppression which resulted in the Civil Rights Movement. Collectivity was pretty much required in this time period to simply over-come hard times and eventually to cause a massive change in opinion. It worked with moderate success, and as such, close family ties/general collectivity seem to have become embedded with most blacks' racial identity. This racial identity can be somewhat confining, as collectivism tends to make a group easier to control if there is an appropriate stimulus. Where-as I can only assume that higher suicide rates of whites are a combination of the poor (I would presume this is one of the biggest factors accounting for minority suicides) along with the recent generation of rich white kids who have everything handed to them. I've also noticed that the parents of this generation tend to be as equally fucked-up, since they apparently don't have to do anything for money, they have time to sit around and pop Prozac while mulling over why their life is so terrible. I will say that the wealthy tend to be subjected to more fake friendships and deception than the average person, but as they saying goes, "Mo money, mo problems."

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This is how we bleed in audio.

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the male side is exceptionally higher due to the girls nagging 24/7

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